My Honest View on the UNC/Duke B-Ball Debate..

[Rockafella]

As far as saying Duke Sucks; Don't worry, I'm not gonna go that far literally because they're actually a good/great team as always...



But being the diehard Carolina fan/ex student that I am, we have to be honest about the big picture.



Everybody knows that college is designed to help you prepare for your career (whatever it may be). This and this alone is a diehard fact that no one should argue. If the primary purpose of college is not for the betterment of the student's future endeavors and career aspirations, then please discuss that argument in another post (although I assure you that you will lose)... My point is this; Coach K will never be as great of a “COLLEGE” basketball coach as Dean Smith because no matter how many championships or games he wins as a college head coach, he's never really done one thing well. And that one thing is the primary reason why people attend college in the first place, to become better prepared for their future careers. College coaches are considered professors in a since, they are not there to “just” teach the game. Their sole purpose is and always will be as a “College” head coach, to prepare their players (which are students) for their future career. Winning is supposed to be a bi-product of their instructions/teachings.



I’m not in anyway saying that Coach K is not a great man or mentor, because I believe he makes his players see a different type of picture just as Dean Smith did. They both taught their players how to become men and accept real-world responsibilities. I commend Coach K for being able to teach his players that even without the greatest talent, through teamwork and a great systematic process, they can indeed overcome any challenge that is put in front of them. They learn that within the team concept, the sum of the parts is greater than any of the parts individually. Coach K’s players also often remain with him to finish school and get their education which is very important (primarily to his basketball players because they are not taught how to succeed or become standout NBA players)…


You can debate all you want, but the truth is the truth and I think we can all see that. For a little clarification, let’s do some research and answer a couple of questions. Dookies are typically smart people and those that didn’t go to duke still often aspire to be considered as a smarter individual so you guys should know that via research, hard evidence can be gained to support one’s theories, hypothesis, or in this case, factual statements.



Now to determine the facts that I prove my above theories, statements lets do some research to discover why I feel Dean Smith was the greatest and proof that he made UNC into the best "college" basketball program in the nation.



Over the past 20 years, how many NBA championship teams didn't have a UNC player on them?? Of those teams, how many had at least one UNC player as a starter (remember the Bulls had Jordan and Scott Williams starting for at least one of their championship runs)?? As a matter of fact, how many All*Star teams over the same 20 year span had a UNC player on them and how many different All*Stars are we talking about here?? For those Duke fans, please tell me what Coach K's record was against Dean Smith. Please execute a little research before you guys discuss and the answer is all very clear... Better yet for you diehard Duke fans, answer the same above NBA questions for Duke and compare them to UNC.


Again folks, do the research and then you can have fun trying to debate the facts!! I'll come back w/ the answers in regards to UNC if you are all to lazy to do a little research, but feel free to comment or at least give the answers that you do know...

[T Rex]

I commend Coach K for being able to teach his players that even without the greatest talent, through teamwork and a great systematic process, they can indeed overcome any challenge that is put in front of them.

Until they ran up against MI state. :lmao:

[Rockafella]

Primarily talking about year in and year out though. Coach K does indeed know how to get the most out of his players... I have to admit that they often over-achieve although I feel that if they don't win the championship or at least the ACC this year then he completely failed them.

[Rockafella]

But anyways, back to those last few questions... ANYBODY KNOW THE ANSWERS and am I the only one that find them really impressive??

[T Rex]

On a side note I'll be going to watch out boys play tonight from 5 rows back behind the tarheel bench. I'll take notes for ya :headbang:

[Hugh Jeffincock]

See if you can interest the team in some outside shooting lessons as well

[Rockafella]

On a side note I'll be going to watch out boys play tonight from 5 rows back behind the tarheel bench. I'll take notes for ya :headbang:

Haha, Still got my active student ID... Should go get some tickets but I just don't have the fucking time. Plus I work 3rd shift so getting up early to get bands and shit just ain't possible.

[wankelnut]

That's like trying to compare Richard Petty to Jeff Gordon

Both Coaches are the best of their respective times

the game is very different from 20 to even 10 years ago

did anyone ever think that maybe Coach K has to pick and choose his player to represent Duke let alone reach the academic standard and testing they must complete before even starting a semester. I mean Duke can't just take any dumb ass Rasheed Wallace and let him fail the test 5 times before suceeding.
On the preparing for the future I see plenty of players, coaches, and comentators that have come from Duke so they aren't really slacking that much on high paying B-Ball futures

As I have said before I like the tarheels as a team but there fans have some silly and pointless arguements

I'm just glad UNC finally got a good coach, I was tired of seeing the last one cry

[Rockafella]

Different times;

So what was Coach K's record against Dean Smith again?? How many NBA All*Stars does Dean Smith have in the NBA RIGHT NOW?? I'm willing to bet more than Coach K...

Your point, is not valid... K Thx, Drive Thru.

[bhilton]

You must have read "The Carolina Way" by Dean Smith - good book - I've got my autographed copy in a safe place.

[bhilton]

His point does hold some validtion. I don't know the real situation but a team/college should have some standards as to who is admitted/playing. And in dean's defense with Rasheed - that was at the end of Dean's career and I have heard that he basically held his hand to get him to go to class so it's not as if Dean was not trying to help the man out.

[1 SLOW 5.0]

Again folks, do the research and then you can have fun trying to debate the facts!! I'll come back w/ the answers in regards to UNC if you are all to lazy to do a little research, but feel free to comment or at least give the answers that you do know...

Damn homie. I'm not trying to take it that far. Just have a little fun, healthy shit talking.

[Sleeper 362]

Well thought of argument but I will say this much; a College professors #1 goal should always be, getting his students to graduate college #2 To make them a better person in life. Preparation for the real world means nothing when you don't accomplish the goal at hand. True preparation for the real world would be a couple punches to the face and a kick in the ass. Which is what the real world is all about. Not about jumping ship when something that seems better comes along. We keep talking about all these kids that are so great in the NBA from Carolina. But what about the ones who jumped ship and didn't do all that great in the NBA? Where are they. At least the majority of Duke players have an outstanding degree they can fall back on.

I am not arguing that Dean Smith wasn't a great coach, he was, but you are also talking about two totally different times. Back in the day when he was coaching people still had morals and an understanding of what a good education is and what it can do for you. Now the people getting recruited are way more arrogant and a bunch of premadonnas. They are becoming harder and harder to coach and keep. Think about all the kids that were highschool seniors going to college the next year when Labronne James was a senior in highschool. You know how cocky most 18 yearolders are. I bet you that whole class of seniors thought that they should be like Labronne and go straight to the pros. Now imagine coaching those kids. I would be in jail for assault. With that trend being the way it is, I would say that K's goals and the job he is doing to meet those goals makes him a better coach. And look we are already comparing him to Dean and K still has probably another decade of coaching left.

Oh yeah and who said the NBA is a career? It is by definition but IMO it is a joke. Its a bunch of lazy bums who have nothing better to do than play a playground game and get paid a silly amount of money to do so. I play that shit for free and with probably more heart than 99% of the guys doing it professionally. I'm just not gifted with the talent they have. Thats why I watch nothing but college ball. At least they still play with heart, and its less talent based ands more fundamental. Another reason why I watch duke.

[Rockafella]

Oh yeah, it's all in good fun and damn the all-star shit cuz we all know Coach K doesn't coach NBA All*Stars (Well, he's a had a few; but other than Grant Hill, who has been a standout - And don't even get me started on what a FLUKE Hill's career has been).

But yeah, it's all in good fun. I just like facts to back up some arguments and I guess we all know wins that...

Just for instance though, let's not rely on the knowledge of a bunch of car nuts. Let's take it to the experts... And of the past 25 years (which would sound like a good time frame to do a study) THE EXPERTS SAY...

BEST COACHES
As selected by ESPN25's Expert Panel

1. Dean Smith

2. Scott Bowman

3. Mike Krzyzewski

4. Phil Jackson

5. Pat Summitt

6. Bill Walsh

7. Don Shula

8. Joe Paterno

9. Eddie Robinson

10. Pat Riley

11. Bill Parcells

12. Geno Auriemma

13. Joe Torre

14. Joe Gibbs

15. Jimmy Johnson

16. Dan Gable

17. Tom Osborne

18. Bela Karolyi

19. Bob Knight

20. Al Arbour

21. Bobby Bowden

22. Larry Brown

23. Steve Spurrier

24. Anson Dorrance

25. Tony La Russa



GOTTA LUV DEM HEELS!!!!

[Rockafella]

Dude, did you really just say that making millions dollars is not a career. Yes, it's a short lived, game that we all play, but when you get paid millions of dollars to do it; It is a career...

And why do you all keep saying that Dean Smith coached so long ago. Yes, he started a long time ago; But many of his players are still in the NBA and still doing better than ANY of Coach K's players so what's your point??

[Enthusiast]

As far as saying Duke Sucks; Don't worry, I'm not gonna go that far literally because they're actually a good/great team as always...



But being the diehard Carolina fan/ex student that I am, we have to be honest about the big picture.



Everybody knows that college is designed to help you prepare for your career (whatever it may be). This and this alone is a diehard fact that no one should argue. If the primary purpose of college is not for the betterment of the student's future endeavors and career aspirations, then please discuss that argument in another post (although I assure you that you will lose)... My point is this; Coach K will never be as great of a “COLLEGE” basketball coach as Dean Smith because no matter how many championships or games he wins as a college head coach, he's never really done one thing well. And that one thing is the primary reason why people attend college in the first place, to become better prepared for their future careers. College coaches are considered professors in a since, they are not there to “just” teach the game. Their sole purpose is and always will be as a “College” head coach, to prepare their players (which are students) for their future career. Winning is supposed to be a bi-product of their instructions/teachings.



I’m not in anyway saying that Coach K is not a great man or mentor, because I believe he makes his players see a different type of picture just as Dean Smith did. They both taught their players how to become men and accept real-world responsibilities. I commend Coach K for being able to teach his players that even without the greatest talent, through teamwork and a great systematic process, they can indeed overcome any challenge that is put in front of them. They learn that within the team concept, the sum of the parts is greater than any of the parts individually. Coach K’s players also often remain with him to finish school and get their education which is very important (primarily to his basketball players because they are not taught how to succeed or become standout NBA players)…


You can debate all you want, but the truth is the truth and I think we can all see that. For a little clarification, let’s do some research and answer a couple of questions. Dookies are typically smart people and those that didn’t go to duke still often aspire to be considered as a smarter individual so you guys should know that via research, hard evidence can be gained to support one’s theories, hypothesis, or in this case, factual statements.



Now to determine the facts that I prove my above theories, statements lets do some research to discover why I feel Dean Smith was the greatest and proof that he made UNC into the best "college" basketball program in the nation.



Over the past 20 years, how many NBA championship teams didn't have a UNC player on them?? Of those teams, how many had at least one UNC player as a starter (remember the Bulls had Jordan and Scott Williams starting for at least one of their championship runs)?? As a matter of fact, how many All*Star teams over the same 20 year span had a UNC player on them and how many different All*Stars are we talking about here?? For those Duke fans, please tell me what Coach K's record was against Dean Smith. Please execute a little research before you guys discuss and the answer is all very clear... Better yet for you diehard Duke fans, answer the same above NBA questions for Duke and compare them to UNC.


Again folks, do the research and then you can have fun trying to debate the facts!! I'll come back w/ the answers in regards to UNC if you are all to lazy to do a little research, but feel free to comment or at least give the answers that you do know...

I have been lurking for a few weeks now, but I just couldn't let this one slide.

So let me get this straight, your saying that Dean Smith better prepared his players for their "future" because of the 20 or so excellent players that have contributed to an NBA championship? What about the hundreds of others that didn't make it to the NBA?

I suppose the hundreds of Duke players that have gone on to the real world with a degree from Duke benefited none from the leadership and the "father they never had" as described by his players. So to that you could say he still didn't teach them anything, but to reply to that I could say that Dean did nothign more for his kids than get them exposure. Both would be equally assinine statements. Now I'm not going to say who is a better coach because sayint Dean Smith isn't the best seems irrational as well as to tell Coach K he is any less of an icon also seems irrational.

Now I don't mean to step on your toes or call you out man, but in the heat of all the basketball arguments lately I believe you might be seeing it with you heart and not your eyes. I truly believe you bleed Carolina blue either way, lol.

[Rockafella]

As far as saying Duke Sucks; Don't worry, I'm not gonna go that far literally because they're actually a good/great team as always...


I’m not in anyway saying that Coach K is not a great man or mentor, because I believe he makes his players see a different type of picture just as Dean Smith did. They both taught their players how to become men and accept real-world responsibilities. I commend Coach K for being able to teach his players that even without the greatest talent, through teamwork and a great systematic process, they can indeed overcome any challenge that is put in front of them. They learn that within the team concept, the sum of the parts is greater than any of the parts individually. Coach K’s players also often remain with him to finish school and get their education which is very important (primarily to his basketball players because they are not taught how to succeed or become standout NBA players)…


Dude, did you totally miss this part of my post?? Please read before making some comments. I agree with you though; just read above... My point was saying that he was not a better "College Head Coach"... I'm not even gonna try to argue about who's the better man or mentor because I believe they are both completely awesome in that respect.

[Smitty8342]

Their sole purpose is and always will be as a “College” head coach, to prepare their players (which are students) for their future career. Winning is supposed to be a bi-product of their instructions/teachings.

So, how come coaches get fired when they don't win?

If Dean Smith wouldn't have won as many games as he did and still had his players be successful in the NBA, do you think you would be talking about how great he was right now?

(dont jump on me like you did with the FSU debate, im just here for some friendly chatter)

[Sleeper 362]

Dude, did you really just say that making millions dollars is not a career. Yep I did say that. Its only because stupid people pay 100+ for a ticket that they get paid so much. I HAVE watched better ball being played at Rutgers Park and in Oak Bluffs MV MA. I have seen street ballers tear apart pro ballers at Oak Bluffs. I can make a million dollars by putting a patent on air. Does that make it a career? How many broke former NBA players are there? I can garuantee you not one of them has a Duke Diploma.

[123ulose]

wanna know everything you need to know about the rivalry between duke and carolina. check out this link alot of interesting stuff i would never have thought was true.

http://slumz.boxden.com/showthread.php?t=534948

[Billyman]

Over the past 20 years, how many NBA championship teams didn't have a UNC player on them?? Of those teams, how many had at least one UNC player as a starter (remember the Bulls had Jordan and Scott Williams starting for at least one of their championship runs)?? As a matter of fact, how many All*Star teams over the same 20 year span had a UNC player on them and how many different All*Stars are we talking about here?? For those Duke fans, please tell me what Coach K's record was against Dean Smith. Please execute a little research before you guys discuss and the answer is all very clear... Better yet for you diehard Duke fans, answer the same above NBA questions for Duke and compare them to UNC.


Ya know, I couldn't give two shits about Duke or UNC or their coaches.

But I will say this:

There's a lot of dumbasses in the NBA and lot of dumbasses that play professional sports period. Some of which can barely read or write much less balance a check book. I love Jordan and I loved the Bull's at one time. Jordan was NBA material out of high school. That wasn't Smith's doing.

You're a dumbass.

[Heater]

But I will say this:

There's a lot of dumbasses in the NBA and lot of dumbasses that play professional sports period. Some of which can barely read or write much less balance a check book. I love Jordan and I loved the Bull's at one time. Jordan was NBA material out of high school. That wasn't Smith's doing.

You're a dumbass.


:lolup:

True True

[Rockafella]

Ya know, I couldn't give two shits about Duke or UNC or their coaches.

But I will say this:

There's a lot of dumbasses in the NBA and lot of dumbasses that play professional sports period. Some of which can barely read or write much less balance a check book. I love Jordan and I loved the Bull's at one time. Jordan was NBA material out of high school. That wasn't Smith's doing.

I'm a dumbass.

Did anyone limit this argument to just MJ... I mean yeah, we all know that UNC has produced one of the greatet male and female sports figures of all time (MJ and Mia Hamm) but I'm not at all limiting this argument to just MJ... If you had read the post, you would know that. But some DUMBASSES aren't fully capable of that.

It's players like Worthy, Perkins, the Smiths, Fox, and Wallace that all started on championship NBA championship teams that I'm talking about. Are maybe Jamison, Carter, Stackhouse and Wallace that are still in the NBA and are All*Star players that I'm talking about. We don't need to limit this to just MJ you idiot. Maybe call the ESPN expert panel all dumbasses as well as they voted Dean Smith to be the greatest coach PERIOD in the last 25 years.

Okay, new rule... All FUCKING IDIOTS; PLEASE REFRAIN FROM POSTING ON THIS BOARD. THX!!

[BIZZY]

That's like trying to compare Richard Petty to Jeff Gordon

Both Coaches are the best of their respective times

the game is very different from 20 to even 10 years ago

did anyone ever think that maybe Coach K has to pick and choose his player to represent Duke let alone reach the academic standard and testing they must complete before even starting a semester. I mean Duke can't just take any dumb ass Rasheed Wallace and let him fail the test 5 times before suceeding.
On the preparing for the future I see plenty of players, coaches, and comentators that have come from Duke so they aren't really slacking that much on high paying B-Ball futures

As I have said before I like the tarheels as a team but there fans have some silly and pointless arguements

I'm just glad UNC finally got a good coach, I was tired of seeing the last one cry


Your argument holds no water as far as academic standards.
Fact:J.R.Reid had a higher SAT than Danny Ferry

Fact:Phil Henderson almost flunked out of Duke

Fact:Rasheed Wallace NEVER was on academic probation,the above mentioned Phil Henderson was

Fact:Carolina has ALWAYS been just as selective for student athletes.If they were not,Kevin Durant(#2 High School baller in the country) would have signed with UNC ,not Texas

[Rockafella]

Damn't son, I love it when Bizzy comes into a UNC post!!

[BIZZY]

Well thought of argument but I will say this much; a College professors #1 goal should always be, getting his students to graduate college #2 To make them a better person in life. Preparation for the real world means nothing when you don't accomplish the goal at hand. True preparation for the real world would be a couple punches to the face and a kick in the ass. Which is what the real world is all about. Not about jumping ship when something that seems better comes along. We keep talking about all these kids that are so great in the NBA from Carolina. But what about the ones who jumped ship and didn't do all that great in the NBA? Where are they. At least the majority of Duke players have an outstanding degree they can fall back on.

I am not arguing that Dean Smith wasn't a great coach, he was, but you are also talking about two totally different times. Back in the day when he was coaching people still had morals and an understanding of what a good education is and what it can do for you. Now the people getting recruited are way more arrogant and a bunch of premadonnas. They are becoming harder and harder to coach and keep. Think about all the kids that were highschool seniors going to college the next year when Labronne James was a senior in highschool. You know how cocky most 18 yearolders are. I bet you that whole class of seniors thought that they should be like Labronne and go straight to the pros. Now imagine coaching those kids. I would be in jail for assault. With that trend being the way it is, I would say that K's goals and the job he is doing to meet those goals makes him a better coach. And look we are already comparing him to Dean and K still has probably another decade of coaching left.

Oh yeah and who said the NBA is a career? It is by definition but IMO it is a joke. Its a bunch of lazy bums who have nothing better to do than play a playground game and get paid a silly amount of money to do so. I play that shit for free and with probably more heart than 99% of the guys doing it professionally. I'm just not gifted with the talent they have. Thats why I watch nothing but college ball. At least they still play with heart, and its less talent based ands more fundamental. Another reason why I watch duke.


I could make the same argument about the movie industry.How does a Tom Hanks,Jim Carrey,Arnold Schwarzenegger,et al make ridiculous amounts of money for one film.The answer? They are the best at what they do.These basketball players are the best at what they do.

As far as life after basketball,there are quite a few former Carolina and Duke players doing quite well for themselves in the media Jay Bilas and Kenny Smith to name two.As far as education not being emphasized at UNC,that's funny.Jerry Stackhouse,Antawn Jamison,and Vince Carter,just to name a few,went back to school to get their degrees.

[TSDuke]

Man, how many times have you rubbed one out thinking of how great Dean Smith WAS?? Something really hit a nerve with you. If anybody doubts how great a coach Smith WAS, or the amount of great NBA players that have come out of unc, they are idiots. You can't argue the facts. But to say that K has never "better prepared his players for their future careers" is asinine. The fact is, unc & DUKE recruit a different type of player. How often do they fight over a recruit? There is no doubt that the carolina players are better built for NBA careers straight out of high school. K recruits players that better fit his style of teaching. Some players, no matter how good in high school & college, just don't make it in the pros. Does that mean that their high school & college coach failed them, NO! The true test would be to look at all the players that didn't make it in pro ball. Did they actually get an education? Are they able to take the skills learned in SCHOOL, & turn it into a career. Do you know the number of division 1 players that actually have a sucessful pro ball career? Probably not. Do you understand that they call it STUDENT ATHLETE for a reason. The job of a college coach is a hard one. Not only is he/she to continue to teach them the fundamentals of basketball, or whatever sport, but also to HELP mold them into better people with the skills to make it outside of their respective sport.

[BIZZY]

Man, how many times have you rubbed one out thinking of how great Dean Smith WAS?? Something really hit a nerve with you. If anybody doubts how great a coach Smith WAS, or the amount of great NBA players that have come out of unc, they are idiots. You can't argue the facts. But to say that K has never "better prepared his players for their future careers" is asinine. The fact is, unc & DUKE recruit a different type of player. How often do they fight over a recruit? There is no doubt that the carolina players are better built for NBA careers straight out of high school. K recruits players that better fit his style of teaching. Some players, no matter how good in high school & college, just don't make it in the pros. Does that mean that their high school & college coach failed them, NO! The true test would be to look at all the players that didn't make it in pro ball. Did they actually get an education? Are they able to take the skills learned in SCHOOL, & turn it into a career. Do you know the number of division 1 players that actually have a sucessful pro ball career? Probably not. Do you understand that they call it STUDENT ATHLETE for a reason. The job of a college coach is a hard one. Not only is he/she to continue to teach them the fundamentals of basketball, or whatever sport, but also to HELP mold them into better people with the skills to make it outside of their respective sport.


To be honest,they recruit the same players.Carolina recruited Grant Hill,Bobby Hurley,Christian Laettner.Duke recruited Brandon Wright,Vince Carter,Jerry Stackhouse.

I also Believe Coach Smith and CRY-SHEFFSKI have done a great deal to make their ball players better people and Coach Williams has done and is doing the same now.

[TSDuke]

To be honest,they recruit the same players.Carolina recruited Grant Hill,Bobby Hurley,Christian Laettner.Duke recruited Brandon Wright,Vince Carter,Jerry Stackhouse.

I also Believe Coach Smith and CRY-SHEFFSKI have done a great deal to make their ball players better people and Coach Williams has done and is doing the same now.

Not saying it never happens, sure it does, but not as often as you would think considering how great both programs are.

Gotta love this rivalry, the best in sports.

[mikey99cobra]

Heres my post for this month

Is it really fair to compare the two coaches now? Should yall be having this discusion when coach K retires. Then and only then can you compare the # of players in the NBA and whatever other fact your want. Smith had his whole career to get his stats, coach K is still going and will be adding to his stats for many years.

By the way, both are and were great coaches.

GO STATE!!!

[Bananaman]

Not saying it never happens, sure it does, but not as often as you would think considering how great both programs are.

Gotta love this rivalry, the best in sports.

Yea, when I was growing up it was All UNC- NC State. Things have changed.

[Heater]

Yea, when I was growing up it was All UNC- NC State. Things have changed.


Yeah, that's the same way it was when I was growing up.
Most of those State fans are now Dook fans.

[Rockafella]

Yea, when I was growing up it was All UNC- NC State. Things have changed.

Yeah it was, And I'm not that old...

But the closeness of UNC and Duke (I was actually sitting in my dorm room at UNC w/ 2 minutes to go in the game before Duke won the NCAA championship a few years back and I left my dorm and was at Duke's campus before the game was over (all of maybe 10 minutes) that late night w/ everyone inside watching the game I guess)... But being that close to each other and being powerhouses as well finally proved to be the ingredients needed to fuel the fire between the two schools. State's still a rivarly; but Nothing compares to UNC and Duke...

On a side note, I really do admire Dean Smith. Met him once at Top of the Hill and he was the coolest old man ever... Also met Roy Williams while I was at school as his daughter was at UNC (Granville Towers) back in 2000 as well...

But anyways, I never stated that Coach KryBaby wasn't a good coach... He's a great coach. I just stated that Coach Smith was better, specially at developing his players!! The record between the two proves it...

[Hugh Jeffincock]

Heres my post for this month

Is it really fair to compare the two coaches now? Should yall be having this discusion when coach K retires. Then and only then can you compare the # of players in the NBA and whatever other fact your want. Smith had his whole career to get his stats, coach K is still going and will be adding to his stats for many years.

By the way, both are and were great coaches.

GO STATE!!!

ns state is like the little brother of the acc, its like yeah they might win a couple games but who gives a shit. :lol:

[Billyman]

Did anyone limit this argument to just MJ... I mean yeah, we all know that UNC has produced one of the greatet male and female sports figures of all time (MJ and Mia Hamm) but I'm not at all limiting this argument to just MJ... If you had read the post, you would know that. But some DUMBASSES aren't fully capable of that.

It's players like Worthy, Perkins, the Smiths, Fox, and Wallace that all started on championship NBA championship teams that I'm talking about. Are maybe Jamison, Carter, Stackhouse and Wallace that are still in the NBA and are All*Star players that I'm talking about. We don't need to limit this to just MJ you idiot. Maybe call the ESPN expert panel all dumbasses as well as they voted Dean Smith to be the greatest coach PERIOD in the last 25 years.


Ok, I haven't read all the "other" arguments in this thread so I’ll only elaborate on this little toss up between you and I.

I understand what you’re saying, I really do but you’re clearly bias. I was only using Jordan as 1 example and not trying to make a full argument out of one man.

Again, I don’t care about Couch K or Dean Smith, I don’t care about Duke or UNC so from a non-biased standpoint, your comparison sucks. You’re comparing these two coaches as to which has sent most to the NBA and is ultimately what? A better coach? Go back and do more research and find out how many of those NBA players would’ve never gotten into college to begin with had it not been for a basketball scholarship. Go back and tell me how many of those in the NBA never even finished college (Jordan again). Most of these guys had no intentions of doing anything but playing basketball. The education they were getting while in college was a side effect of being there. Some of the best players from a shit load of colleges (Duke and UNC included) never went to the NBA because they chose not too………….for they went to college with anterior motives. Steve Hale is a prime example of this. The man was fuckin’ awesome on the court and it wasn’t a collapsed lung that stopped him from going pro it was his original ambition of becoming a doctor. That’s why he went to college in the first place. There wasn’t a coach on earth that was going to change his mind.

Contrary to your belief, there are people in college trying to learn something and it isn’t how to run up and down a court bouncing balls even if they love doing that.

I cannot comprehend how your comparison is remotely justified. To me, your argument holds as much water as a burlap sack.

[Rockafella]

Well you're obviously a fucking idiot or didn't read the post in its entirety. I know everyone doesn't attend college w/ just hopes of bouncing a fucking ball up and down the court. Didn't say that they did. I stayed with the entire football team at UNC and a lot of those guys knew that football was just their way into the university and there were others that knew that football had nothing with them getting in, but utilized it because it payed for their way through school.

What the original post is trying to state, is that if basketball is your primary concern and you have the desire to become the best at that you can possibly become, Then Dean Smith was obviously the best at preparing you for your future. Actually, UNC as a University does a better job of preparing their players for a career in that sport if that's that person's desire. Not saying that sports is the primary reason to attend a university (hell I left UNC because they didn't have engineering which is what I'm currently majoring in now, so I can say this with attitude) but no-one has been on this site arguing about which University has the better English department now have they?? We've been discussing which school is better in Basketball (which is the reason why B-Ball is in the title of the thread) and I believe that UNC has a better Basketball Program... Feel free to debate if you that's your heart's sole desire, but the post that you've added to this thread clearly shows that you a.) didn't read the first post in its entirety or b.) just failed to completely comprehend what the original post was trying to state.

And then you enter this thread by calling someone a dumbass?? WOW, the nerve of some people.

Anyways, the debate is all in fun as there is no "REAL" answer, but some folks just tick a nerve when they start making personal comments to a matter they for one, don't give a damn about and 2; shouldn't be fucking commenting on in the first place because they lack the knowledge to participate effectively in a fucking debate...

Go find a chevy vs. ford or coke vs. pepsi thread and give your $.02 because if you don't give a fuck about UNC or Duke then your presence is not needed in this thread. THX...

[Jayber]

hurray im fer de otter teem :D